In this insightful episode of Stories of Change, we sit down with Swanand Deo, Founder of Design Junction, to explore the crucial role of a well-crafted website in the nonprofit sector.
Transcript of this episode
Simit: Thank you, Swanand, for joining us on this podcast. It’s really a pleasure to have you here.
Swanand: It’s my pleasure to be here.
Simit: Of course. So today we are going to talk about the importance of websites in the nonprofit sector. Let’s get started. You’ve been involved in website development for many years, right? You’ve created various websites, apps, and executed different types of multimedia projects. From your perspective, what do you think are the most important components of a website? Can you share your thoughts on that?
Swanand: Essentially, websites should be developed from two perspectives. What often happens is that we just create or develop a website as a task. Once that task is completed, it doesn’t hold much significance in terms of what it can achieve in the future, or how it can communicate our mission or vision to others. Without considering all these aspects, people just create a website, and as a result, they don’t get conversions, nor does their vision reach anyone, and the website’s goal remains unfulfilled. They just say, “This is our website,” and that’s it. After that, there are no updates, nor does anyone pay attention to the design or functionality. It’s just, “We’ve made a website.”
What often happens is that we just create or develop a website as a task.
Simit: If you look at the situation today, a website is no longer something that can simply be created and left untouched for one, two, or five years. The era of static websites is gone, right? Nowadays, many organisations update their websites multiple times a day depending on their product or the issue they’re working towards. So, it’s no longer something that you can just develop and set aside. Could you elaborate on that?
Swanand: What organisations tend to do now is treat a website as a one-time task. Once it’s done, there’s nothing more to update. There’s a context behind this, though. The reason for which you’re developing the website is key. What is your mission behind creating it? What do you want to achieve with it? If that is clear, then you’ll create a website that aligns with those goals. If you’re making a website just for the sake of it, it’s fine even if you don’t make it because it won’t be visible anywhere. Only websites that are regularly updated appear on the first ten pages of Google. If your website has no updates, then it’s practically invisible because there are so many websites now, and every organisation is focusing on theirs, knowing what they want from it.
Static websites belong to a very old era. People may have websites that are 15 years old, but their businesses are established, and they only need a website for the sake of having one. This is common in the manufacturing sector, which primarily has B2B customers rather than B2C ones.
If your website has no updates, then it’s practically invisible.
Simit: So they’ve created it and just kept it. If someone wants to see the website, they can access the link.
Swanand: Yes, it’s just for the sake of having a website. However, in an organisation, something is happening every day. They have ongoing activities, so a static website is not feasible for them. The structure of the organisation also plays a role in this. While people are employed in various roles, not everyone can manage a website. They often rely on the developer.
Another factor is cost. What happens is when an organisation wants to create a website, they try to get it done as cheaply as possible. First, they look for freelancers or interns to build the website. After it’s created, that intern may get busy with their job, or the freelancer becomes occupied with other projects, leaving the organisation’s website neglected. Then they have to start over, which becomes a roadblock for them. They wonder what to do with their website now.
Simit: Often in the social sector, especially for NGOs, many organisations are very active when it comes to securing donations or raising funds effectively. Similarly, the website becomes a tool for recruiting volunteers or interns, whether they’re international or local. A website isn’t just about showcasing your work; it serves many purposes. Many organisations approach us for help because, as you mentioned, their website was created by an intern or freelancer, but now no one is there to manage it, and they don’t understand how it works on the back end. So how can this issue be addressed?
Swanand: Another point I forgot to mention is that many organisations face issues with their domain names. For example, when a freelancer acquires a domain for an organisation, there’s often no one responsible for renewing it. Once the domain expires, it’s gone. Today, like food, clothing, and shelter, it could be food, clothing, and domain. Another organisation could take advantage of the name you worked hard to build.
Today, like food, clothing, and shelter, it could be food, clothing, and domain.
First and foremost, an organisation should acquire and retain control of its domain name. They can then entrust the management to someone else or hire a reputable agency. The key is that the rights to the domain should remain with the organisation so that if something happens in the future, they retain control of their property. This is the first thing to remember when creating a website. Your domain and rights should stay with you so that you can make decisions about them later.
Regarding your question, websites do serve multiple purposes, including volunteering and fundraising. In the past, people would go door to door to share brochures about their work, asking for donations. But with technology now, it’s easy to send money through payment gateways like GPay. We can use this to our advantage with websites. However, when receiving funds, security is paramount. Merely having a website and expecting funds to start flowing in won’t work.
The payment gateway you use, and the security measures you implement to ensure the funds reach you and not someone else, are crucial considerations. This isn’t something one person can handle alone. You need to work with someone or an agency with enough experience and expertise.
Personally, I prefer agencies because they can manage all these multidimensional aspects for you. These are important considerations. The next point is design. You need to target two things: volunteers and funds. If your website lacks a clear Call To Action (CTA) button, what will a volunteer do? They need a form to fill out or a way to support the cause. These are the things a website must have, and they’re often missing. If I’m a volunteer and I visit your website to help your cause, but there’s no clear action plan for me, I’ll simply check another website.
If your website lacks a clear Call To Action (CTA) button, what will a volunteer do?
Simit: You’ve raised two or three very important points. One is the absence of the CTA, the Call To Action, and when it is present, there are often too many of them. The hero image might have several buttons highlighted, making it difficult to understand what to focus on or where to look because the user becomes overwhelmed by the messaging. There’s so much content on the landing page that users don’t know whether to click here or there.
Swanand: Exactly. Organisations often think they should display all the data they have, allowing users to pick whatever they want. But it doesn’t work like that. When you keep the content minimal and focused, only then will your message resonate and encourage user action.
Simit: I actually noticed this when I was researching this topic. Whenever you visit top websites, they tend to focus on just one thing, and they have only one clear call to action.
Take Netflix, for example. When you go on Netflix, there’s only one CTA: “Buy our plan” or “Subscribe.” Similarly, if you look at any top organisation’s website, there’s just one consistent message. There’s no confusion about where to click or what to focus on.
Swanand: That’s why I emphasised that you need to define your goal for creating the website first. Once you have clarity on that, you’ll understand what you need to focus on, and that’s what makes a good website. Simply building a website isn’t enough.
You need to define your goal for creating the website first.
Simit: In the nonprofit sector, many organisations feel that they have a lot of data and content, so they try to put everything on the website. As a result, when someone visits the site, they get lost in all the information. The purpose of the organisation, which might be to convey their story, gets lost. What has your experience been in this regard?
Swanand: My experience has been that organisations often have a lot of information, and they want all of it on the site. However, it’s not organised sequentially, like a sitemap, where each piece of content should go. Essentially, they don’t map out the user journey. No one thinks about where a user will go next after landing on the homepage, or if a volunteer arrives, what information they should receive. Instead, they just want to add all their content, photos, and information about what they do. But that approach doesn’t work. You need to know what your user is looking for and tailor the experience accordingly.
No one thinks about where a user will go next after landing on the homepage.
Users now have a very short attention span. They don’t have the time to explore your entire website or read through all your content. They’ll only spend a few minutes on your site, and if you can capture their attention in that time, you’ve succeeded.
Simit: Even five minutes is a lot.
Swanand: Actually, people just scroll now. They’re used to scrolling, like on Instagram. It’s 30 seconds, then they move on. If you can capture their attention within that time, only then can you convert them. This applies to everyone, whether you have an organisation, a business, or an e-commerce store.
For example, when you visit Flipkart, you don’t spend much time on it. What do you do? You immediately look for special offers and click on them; you don’t explore the entire website. If you get a reference for a product, you go directly to the product page. If you want to capture the user’s attention, you need to have content, design, and CTA buttons that enable them to take immediate action.
If you want to capture the user’s attention, you need to have content, design, and CTA buttons.
Simit: So basically, you’re saying that creating a website is not just the developer’s job. If you simply tell a developer to make a website, they may handle the technical backend, but there are multiple layers to it. Several teams are involved, such as design, content, and those who understand what type of content should go on the website and how concisely it should be presented.
Swanand: More impact in fewer words.
Simit: Exactly. Just because you have information, it doesn’t mean you should put all of it on the website. Otherwise, if there’s an individual donor, corporate donor, volunteer, or any other stakeholder, they’ll get lost in the clutter.
Swanand: No matter how much good work an organisation does, it all comes down to storytelling. How well they engage a user in their story determines whether the user connects with them. If not, there’s no connection. You’ve just filled up the site with content, and that’s it.
Simit: Of course. I see a lot of websites, particularly because we’re in the same space, so I have to. I’ve noticed that there’s a typical format. If you study this a bit, especially in the social sector, all the reputed organisations that have cracked this follow a certain pattern. Under the hero image, there’s an ‘About Us’ section, very short, written in less than 50–60 words. It succinctly explains what the organisation does.
After that, when you scroll down, you see their programmes with different thematic areas they’re working in, like agriculture, livelihood, education, healthcare, climate change, and so on. Then they showcase their impact numbers, reflecting their achievements in these thematic areas. Following that, they feature their existing partners, testimonials, or case studies.
Finally, there are footnotes or footers on the website. This seems to be the typical format I see on websites of reputed organisations that have invested heavily in communication. What has your experience been in this?
Swanand: This is the same format. Essentially, images convey more than words. They immediately show what the organisation is doing. By using high-quality images, you effectively communicate the sector in which the organisation operates, whether it’s education, agriculture, or something else. This visual information helps users quickly understand the organisation’s focus.
Following that, users want to know where the organisation is based, who is on the team, and other relevant details. This is where the second section of the website comes into play. The third section answers questions like, “How can I get involved?” and “What does this have for me?” It highlights sectors the organisation works in and showcases donors and partners. This builds trust with users, demonstrating the organisation’s credibility. In today’s age of fraud, where fake websites can quickly appear and disappear with donations, displaying these details is crucial for reassuring users and encouraging them to donate or volunteer.
Simit: You’ve raised an important point. Many organisations in the social sector struggle with having good photos, often due to limited resources for professional photography. As a result, they might use lower-quality phone photos on their websites.
Could you explain why having good photos is so important for a website?
Swanand: Photos have a significant impact—often more than words. If a photo clearly conveys its message, people are more likely to engage with it and read the accompanying text. That’s why websites often feature large images with smaller text. If organisations don’t showcase their work visually, the message gets lost. Many organisations and businesses neglect the power of photos, but a single good photo can achieve a lot.
You can either invest in quality photography or use stock images, though stock images lack a personal touch. Photos from your actual projects provide a sense of authenticity and connection. In India, there’s often a lack of local photos, leading organisations to use images from abroad, which can create a disconnect. Therefore, it’s crucial to take high-quality, relevant photos, keeping in mind that they’ll be viewed by many people.
Photos from your actual projects provide a sense of authenticity and connection.
Photos should also be clear and appropriately sized; small images that become pixelated when enlarged are not effective. Additionally, it’s important to consider different orientations—portrait mode is especially useful for mobile optimisation, as most phones are used in portrait mode.
Simit: Speaking of mobiles, that leads me to my next point: mobile optimisation. In the past, websites were primarily developed for desktops and laptops, but now most users access websites via mobile devices. Many sites still aren’t mobile-optimised. What trends are emerging in mobile optimisation, and what should organisations be aware of?
Swanand: We’ve seen a major shift over time. Initially, Nokia mobiles didn’t support browsing, but with the advent of Androids, mobile browsing became user-friendly and prevalent. Nowadays, people prefer accessing everything on their phones rather than desktops or laptops. For example, sending an email is now often done directly from a mobile device rather than a laptop. Similarly, users primarily view websites on their phones. If your website isn’t mobile-friendly, you’re missing out because mobile usage has surged with the availability of free internet and the convenience of mobile devices.
Nowadays, people prefer accessing everything on their phones rather than desktops or laptops.
Simit: So, you’re saying that a website needs to be designed to look good not just on desktops and laptops, but also on mobiles. Developers should ensure that all pages are properly displayed on mobile devices without any parts being cut off or misaligned.
Swanand: Exactly. Additionally, tablets are another important consideration. They are widely used as well, so optimising for tablets is also crucial.
Simit: Absolutely. When we recently revamped our website, we meticulously checked every page on various devices—mobiles, laptops, desktops—to identify and fix any display issues. It was a detailed process involving both frontend and backend adjustments.
Swanand: That’s why having an expert is essential. They ensure that everything is done correctly and effectively. Without expert input, your website may not meet its potential.
Simit: Right. This brings me to another point. Many organisations have a communications person who handles various tasks, including content creation and social media management, but may not have the expertise to code or manage the technical aspects of a website. Organisations often face dilemmas about the best platform for their website. Should they use a template-based service like Wix, or opt for a fully customised coded website? New technologies like Webflow also offer another option. What’s your perspective on choosing the right approach for a website?
Swanand: The first step is defining the organisation’s goals. Understanding what the organisation wants to achieve helps in deciding the right platform. Factors like budget, scalability, and user-friendliness of the platform are crucial. If the platform is too complicated, it can be challenging for both website viewers and managers to handle.
Understanding what the organisation wants to achieve helps in deciding the right platform.
For example, WordPress is popular because it has a strong community and flexibility, but you need to consider the costs and effort required if you need to add new functions later, such as a payment gateway. Deciding these aspects early on makes choosing the right platform easier. There are hundreds of website platforms, but selecting one that is popular and suitable for your needs is key.
Simit: Many people get misled into choosing platforms like HTML-coded websites, which can lead to issues if they don’t have a web developer. They might find themselves stuck with a particular agency because only that agency understands the backend code. What has been your experience with this?
Swanand: Building a relationship with clients is essential. Understanding the client’s needs helps determine whether a platform like WordPress or a fully customised solution is appropriate. Customised development is necessary for complex websites requiring features like user interactions, multiple branches, or extensive data integration. While customised websites offer flexibility, they are costly and require ongoing developer support. For most NGOs, a customised solution may not be necessary, as their needs are typically less complex.
While customised websites offer flexibility, they are costly and require ongoing developer support.
Simit: So, for most NGOs, which have broad and specific goals like soliciting donations or showcasing their work, a basic website is often sufficient?
Swanand: Exactly. Many organisations, like Women’s Saving Groups selling products online, can effectively use a basic website. The needs of these organisations can usually be met with simpler, user-friendly platforms.
Simit: My next question was related to this. If you have an organisation and you’ve created a website, how can you ensure it ranks in the top search results? What should organisations do for this? SEO plays a big role, right? Can you tell us a bit about that?
Swanand: Google works by crawling your website—updating its database with the information from your site. This means Google stores and processes all the data so it can provide relevant information when users search. SEO isn’t a quick fix; it’s a long-term process. It involves technical factors and ongoing work. Organisations need dedicated people to manage SEO daily, focusing on keywords, trends, and top searches on Google.
The introduction of AI has made searches more precise and data more targeted. SEO revolves around keeping your website updated, addressing trending topics, and ensuring regular updates. If your website isn’t updated, Google may overlook it. Essentially, Google needs fresh content to index and display.
SEO isn’t a quick fix; it’s a long-term process.
Simit: Regardless of how beautifully you design your website, without SEO, it won’t rank well. It could end up buried in search results.
Swanand: Exactly. Your competitors are also investing in SEO, which is why their sites rank higher. If you’ve just built a website and left it, it won’t perform well. Your competitors are actively improving their SEO every day. Without updates, why would Google prioritise your site?
Simit: So, if you search for ‘Top 10 education NGOs in India,’ the results you see, like CRY or Akshaya Patra, are a result of effective SEO?
Swanand: Yes, SEO efforts lead to higher visibility. When more users visit your site and engage with it, the ranking improves. This process is often invisible but crucial.
Simit: It sounds like a continuous effort.
Swanand: Absolutely. SEO is ongoing work, and keeping up with it is essential to maintain and improve your site’s visibility in search results.
Simit: This is invisible work.
Swanand: Right. We cannot show this to the client that this is the tick mark and this is what we have done. This work keeps happening and patience is very important. You may think that, “It has been three months, my website is still not showing up on Google after searching.” Don’t give it a time frame of three months or six months or one year. This is a daily process or a routine. Even if you do it for six months and leave it, your competitor is still working so there will be no effect.
Simit: Maybe your website will come on top if you search the name, but if you search the keywords then it will not. For example, if I put the name, ‘Simit Bhagat Studios,’ then the website will come on top because of the name, because that is unique to me. But if I search for the top creative agency in India, then it might not come up. That is what you’re saying. If I want top results, I need SEO optimisation.
Swanand: And you have to keep doing it.
Simit: And I have to keep doing it. It’s not a one-time activity that can be done and left. It is an ongoing process.
Swanand: You should allocate a budget for it.
Simit: Budget is what the organisations don’t have. The biggest drawback of the social sector is that we don’t have the resources to do a lot of things.
Swanand: You can hire resources also. It is not that you don’t get the resources. Interns can also work on SEO. You don’t need experts for it. If you prefer experts for websites, I prefer experts for website development because only a professional will be able to do it well. But for SEO, you can hire interns. There are a lot of schools and colleges where you can get interns who are ready to do work.
Interns can also work on SEO.
Simit: But are they reliable? Isn’t it a lot at stake, like we have handed the keys to the treasure to the interns?
Swanand: Basically, you are not giving them any access to your property. Whatever you are giving is in front of you. They don’t need back access. Whatever content is going up is going through you. You cannot tell an intern to go do whatever they want. It is your brand’s reputation, so whatever content is being put up will be checked by you for reliability and relatability.
Simit: A lot of times, we hear that an organisation’s website has been hacked. What precautions can an organisation take to avoid this situation? Can you tell us a bit about this? Or if you have experienced something like this where maybe your client’s website got hacked or someone else’s site got hacked and they came to you?
Swanand: We usually work with WordPress. Our major work is done with WordPress, which is an open-source platform. Updating security measures and functionality regularly is essential. Your website should be updated accordingly. For example, the WordPress source code and plugins need to be updated.
Another factor is website hosting. There’s a concept called shared server, where there is a single CPU and on that, 100 accounts are made and 100 websites are hosted. You purchase a portion for yourself or your organisation and add your website to it. Now, however many updates you add, if someone’s website gets hacked, your website can also be compromised. It’s like a cold or fever; if one site is infected, others can be too.
Regularly backing up your website is crucial. Many times, it has happened that an entire server’s data centre has been destroyed, and if that happens, they may not take responsibility. If you purchase a portion of the server, it’s often mentioned that “This data is your responsibility, not ours. We are only providing you with a platform.”
Regularly backing up your website is crucial.
Simit: No one reads that.
Swanand: Exactly. Either you assign an agency to handle it or learn how to do backups yourself. Backing up your website is very beneficial because it helps you avoid major problems later on. Rebuilding a website from scratch, including redesign and data collection, is much more challenging for an organisation than for a developer.
Simit: I think I can keep talking about website and website-related questions for hours, but we are coming to the end of our podcast. So I would like to ask you the last two or three things. Typically, if an NGO or a social sector organisation wants to create a new website, what are the few things they should keep in mind? Can you tell us three to five things that every person or organisation needs to keep in mind?
Swanand: Let’s start from the beginning. Firstly, if you are choosing a domain, it should be precise and straightforward. A domain that is too long or random will not work well. Opt for top-level domains such as .com, .in, .net, and .org, as these are easily recognised by search engines.
Secondly, the goal for your website should be clear. Define what you want to achieve with your site. A website functions as a marketing tool even while you’re asleep, so it’s important to ensure that your marketing goals are well-defined to guide the website’s development.
Thirdly, the content on your website should be engaging and appealing. It should not just be a collection of information but should tell your story compellingly. An interesting story will attract readers and encourage them to share it with others.
A website functions as a marketing tool even while you’re asleep.
Additionally, regular maintenance and updates are crucial. A website should not be created and then left unattended. Regular updates, security checks, and backups are essential to keep the site functioning smoothly.
Lastly, ensure that your website is mobile-friendly and responsive across various devices such as mobiles, laptops, and desktops. These are some of the fundamental aspects to keep in mind for a successful website.
Simit: Thank you so much, Swanand. It was wonderful speaking with you, and you’ve provided us with so many valuable insights. I wish we could continue for another hour, but thank you for your time.
Swanand: Thank you, Simit.
